No announcement yet.

Auto Transmission Cold Gear Changes

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #61
    Thanks White One


    • #62
      Car went back to Toyota again for the gears issue. Mechanic came for a drive with me & experienced the "flare/hesitation" as he describes it. Then we test drove a demo Fortuner with me driving. Same thing with the demo. In part the report says... "found both vehicles with consistence characteristics. Carried out snap shot of data of both vehicles"..."was all ok, no fault codes present in management system. Measured wheel diameter, fund the same as other tested vehicle. However, vehicle height was vastly different. This vehicle is 3.5 cm higher. This will affect the drive ability of the vehicle under certain circumstances" The demo we went out in had no lift kit.

      Others may help me understand, but the report says both vehicles had consistent characteristics, meaning the demo car also had flare/hesitation. Then the report contradicts itself by saying my 3.5 cm lift may affect it. How can this be when the demo car is stock & has the flare/hesitation problem.

      This is the 5th time the dealer has looked at the gears issue, & the 3rd time a tech/mechanic has come for a test drive. All 3 have said they noticed what I'm talking about. Anyway....

      I mentioned before I'd sent a Registered letter, (15 July), to Toyota in Melbourne about the gears issue. It had my email, & home address. As yet, no reply. Must be in the to hard basket (or torn up). If I do hear from Toyota, I'll let you know. Sorry for all the words....


      • #63
        They mention the ride height to alleviate the issue being their fault.
        i have been thinking a lot about what you are experiencing and yes my vehicle will do the something similar. To me the flare hesitation is from the gearbox being in a low gear when driving with a certain throttle and then after coasting (especially down hill a bit) you find that it’s still in same low gear when you get back on the throttle, yet expecting a higher gear.
        I have found that I have changed my driving habits when I know this will happen. So basically I will only apply a very light throttle until it up changes. This stops the flare issue.

        should it do this? Probably not but I understand that with no throttle signal and vehicle coasting after removing the throttle there is no input data to TCM saying it needs to change up a gear. Yet we would like it to already be changed up as we accelerate.
        hope this makes sense.


        • #64
          Yep, makes sense and comments appreciated as always. You're right re them mentioning the lift to exonerate any possible Toyota problem with the car.

          I do play around with my driving habits to alleviate it but even that's hit and miss. It always does coming out of 2 particular down hill left hand turns. I've tried slowing right down to an almost stop, and even coasting around these corners to let it change gear, then a mild acceleration, but no go.

          The guy I spoke to on picking up the car said they're sending details of my gearbox issues to Toyota, and that they'll use this info and other similar complaints to find a fix or do a recall. Same old story here and not just with Toyota. One or two complaints is bad luck and no problem. But two hundred complaints will make them look into it.

          Just frustrating. Their mechanics on the test runs all feel it and comment about it, but their reports keep saying nothing's wrong.


          • #65
            Anthony, on the particular downhill turns manually put it in 5th gear before the turn. I found it drives out of corner as you would expect it to.


            • #66
              Thanks Luke, I'll try it out over the next few days & report back.


              • #67
                Found this 'ozzie' Hilux discussion site which talks about the gearbox flaring. Seems the gearbox flaring is quite a common problem. On reading the thread by Ian 26 dated 18 & 23 January 2019, apparently the fault has been identified as being solenoid related. If it's the problem, hopefully a fix is on the way & not far off. Perhaps what's mentioned makes sense to those of you with mechanical knowledge!? At the very least I found interesting to read, & know the flaring its just on Fortuners.



                • Spook1205
                  Spook1205 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Oh my.... what mess
                  I’ll put scantool on gearbox data and see what it says with what I feel as not selecting up when it could be.

              • #68
                My car has this issue, but it doesn't really bother me in normal use. I found that explanation interesting (going into neutral). I find the car "runs-away" a bit before the gear engages when descending steep hills off-road. I find this quite disconcerting but I don't know if its normal for an auto (my last 4wd was a manual). Perhaps it's the same issue? Though it does it from a standing start (albeit already pointing downhill).


                • #69
                  The neutral description is what I used to say it felt like... travelling in drive putting in neutral for 1-2 secs then back in drive. Now that I'm "mechanically tech savvy" I call it flaring.

                  I've only been off-road a few times in the Tuner, but not experienced the running away scenario. On steeper descents I've put it into low range, then selected 1st gear, & found the engine braking great, & much better braking than my diesel Patrol. Hopefully your running away prob isn't serious and can be explained.

                  re the flaring, it does pi$$ me off a bit. I'm into the 60s & owned a lot of automatic cars, including auto petrol & diesel 4WDs. Its my first Toyota & a retirement present to myself, but its the only brand of car I've had gear issues with. Hopefully they can fix it.


                  • #70
                    Re the above link above at #67, & remembering what Ian26 said on his post dated 18 Jan 2019, I've been slowing down to under 20kph (speedo reading) when going around corners, over speed bumps or roundabouts, then mildly accelerating as you normally would. This is when the gears flare. If I do the same but at a speed over 20kph, the gear change is fine... no flaring.

                    Got a call yesterday (Friday) from Sydney City Toyota, saying they've done all they can at their end & can't do any more. He said I can take it to another Toyota dealer for them to experience the problem & see if they can fix it. Their computers show nothing wrong with the car, so as far as they're concerned that's it. However, he did say they submitted some type of report to Toyota about my gears concerns. So basically in roundabout terms, if they get enough complaints they might do something about it, maybe.


                    • #71
                      It really needs to be programmed to change up 1 gear under those driving conditions.


                      • #72
                        I took the car to an auto transmission guy who, 1) serviced the gearbox and 2) carried out a 1 turn adjustment to the SLT Line Pressure Solenoid. Nice guy but he even admitted he had trouble finding info on this gearbox, so the adjustment thing was a suck it and see scenario. Result, car feels more responsive to drive, but the gear flaring going from 2nd to 3rd gear still happens. I'll let him know.

                        Now for those with mechanical knowledge, he sourced the gearbox diagram / info from a U.S. Toyota Tacoma 2015-2018 Service site. The auto box in the Fortuner is an AC60F, which apparently has 6 Linear adjustable solenoids, but he couldn't adjust them. He did say why but the info overload was going in 1 ear and out the other by then... sorry.

                        He's got a $1million computer in an air conditioned room, but as there's no template/software/info for our auto box yet, he couldn't hook it up for testing. At least this guy's trying to find a fix, which is more than Toyota are doing at present with me. I'll let you know more as it happens.


                        • #73
                          Today I drove the transmission guy around for a while to replicate what I experience re the gear flaring. When he experienced & realised what I was on about, he said there's nothing wrong with the gearbox. It is all to do with the 'strategy' of the computers in the car and is tied up in the throttle position sensor. There's nothing can be done to fix the issue I experience, the car is performing per the parameters set by Toyota. He did put diagnostics on it yesterday but found nothing wrong.

                          The upshot is, its the way I drive causes the flaring issue I have. So basically, if I'm under brakes at either above 20kph or 15kph or below when going over a speed bump, take a corner or a roundabout & accelerate the flaring doesn't occur. Seems to happen when between 15-20kph. Peace of mind at last, hopefully...

                          This transmission guy said he's a member of the Sonix Committee, (not sure of the spelling) which is apparently a 30 strong team of transmission type people dealing with gearbox associated issues. Might make sense to those with a mechanical background, but hey, it sounded impressive to a novice like me.


                          • #74
                            Hi Anthony, I finally got around to looking at the transmission data. First I had to confirm the driving conditions that cause the engine RPM flare.
                            Normally it is not an issue to the degree others find it, this just comes down to cornering speed of driving. As I have found that only a few kms an hour will make a difference.

                            The data in the picture attached shows engine RPM up the top, then vehicle speed and lastly the shift status.
                            What it proves is that on coasting being in 3rd gear the vehicle will down shift to1st gear once the vehicle speed drops to approx 16 kms hr.

                            You can see the shift down to 1st then the engine RPM flare, at this stage the transmission will shift to second.

                            In a nutshell the gearbox / engine RPM flare is caused by the downshift from 3rd to 1st gear when coasting speed drops to approximately 16km hr.

                            If it only downshifted to 2nd this wouldn't occur or be not as severe. Or you can drive around town manually shifted to S5, this will force the gearbox to select the highest gear within its operating parameters.

                            I hope this helps all those who experience this issue. But please use and share this info as necessary.
                            A transmission tuner may be able to fix this, as the cause is pinpointed.

                            Just a note that this was not a severe flare but quite noticeable, on testing for confirmation it did occur a lot worse than the data captured.
                            Last edited by Spook1205; 1 week ago.


                            • #75
                              Thanks Luke, much appreciated. I'm driving with attention to being under 15kph or over 20kph around corners, over speed humps etc, & it never missed a beat. But, once in that 15-20kph bracket, it happens.

                              I'll get your info & graph to the transmission guy I've been dealing with. Although he says the box is within Toyota's parameters & it isn't damaged, he found it interesting it happens. Said he'd raise the issue with that international committee he's on.

                              Anyway, I'll ask if there's a chance the issue can be resolved or not. I'll post his thoughts after I speak to him.